//
About Equal Money
  1.  “Would you allow for secondary forms of exchange? Like, um, a market, for instance? Or would this be completely illegal ? Would it have to be a black-market? Because, if that’s the case, then I wonder this: ASSUMING you WOULD stop me, HOW would you STOP ME? That is my question: how would you stop me?
  2. Equal money is Communism!
  3. “I find the scheme objectionable. They say “the goal is to establish equality on a basic physical level – equal housing and electricity, equal food and water, equal health care and equal education. But human individuals don’t have equal needs for these things, so the whole thing is a nonsense.”
  4. being that there is the opportunity to earn extra money for things that aren’t necessarily needed in order to live, wouldn’t this open up potential for crime and greed again?
  5. what kind of extra, non-necessities would there be if no one was working to make unnecessary goods? Or could some people work to make luxuries? Wouldn’t this also get people to make personal incomes without helping society, thus creating more potential for greed? Or would the system actually make it illegal to make luxuries? There would have to be luxuries in order for people to want to work extra.
  6. And what about the possible lack of work on jobs like sewage control? It would be much more pleasant to work with food or water, so why not do that instead of sewage? It all pays the same. Or would certain unpleasant jobs pay more
  7. what about people’s rights to live differently if they want to? Would this not be an option?
  8. What would happen to someone if they did not comply with this system? It seems that this will be a big problem to a lot of people, particularly when the system first starts (Although I’m sure if it happens, it won’t just come out of nowhere. People would probably be used to the idea before it is fully used.).
  9. If everyone is given the same amount of money at birth, are they told what to spend it on? What if they run out? Do they just get more?
  10. Why using Money as a solution – will money not lead to corruption again?
  11. But if everyone has equal money, who will do the work that is required to sustain society ?
  12. How will the Money-system be managedwho can be trusted?(Ps: many of the answers come from other Destonians as well)

 

1. “Would you allow for secondary forms of exchange? Like, um, a market, for instance? Or would this be completely illegal? Would it have to be a black-market? Because, if that’s the case, then I wonder this: ASSUMING you WOULD stop me, HOW would you STOP ME? That is my question: how would you stop me?”

Sounds like a question asked to try and call us dictators or fascists or whatever. If a secondary form of exchange is abusive, or creates abuse, then no it will not be allowed. Period. And abuse is abuse, in facts . Such as exploitation for example. Considering our limitations in this existence, because I mean for bugs for example, they still die when we step on them when we walk in the grass.
Also realise that when you create alternative routes, it inevitable leads to big consequences to the overall function of the system. So we simply have to look out for that, have models and see what will work and what will not work. This has to be worked out in detail.

So the real question is: if there would be a system that does what is best for all, that takes care of people worldwide (through the people as well of course), why would a person then want to disagree with the world and what is best for all? Best for all means best for all, again considering our limitations in this reality.

The Equal money system is a system that will lead to a world where people understand what it means to live as equals and to understand why we have become the way we are right now. Greed and ego control the world right now, so humanities perception is shaped by those in power. They have the means and money to present things in a way so the status quo is not changed.

It also looks like the person is fearing control, fears being controlled, etc… realise, we already are.
Look at the system we have worldwide. Starvation, exploitation, forced prostitution, sweatshop work, commercials to make people into good consumers, dumbing down the population, creating stereotypes and judgements etc…
If you fear being in a prison, you haven’t woken up to the one you already are in.

2. Equal money is Communism!

Equal money is not communism, where one isn’t allowed to have more than the other. Equal money means equality as life, as our birth right,, and a person can still work and earn extra money  for extra things.

We are right now conditioned in a world that makes sure we remain in the bubble of the pursuit of happiness , actually the pursuit of money. When everyone is equally supported and can live a dignified life, wanting and desiring to have the most money or power can only come from a starting point of ego or greed. Why is this allowed? Why do we allow abusers that only care for themselves to decide the plan of this world? It is like a sickness. It actually reminds me of something I heard about in university, and that is “the pursuit of loneliness”. Where people deny their connectiveness with each other and isolate themselves, where they find others a nuisance much more easily and start to treat each other as objects, going into competition to try and fill the gab, by getting more power and fighting for their ego, trying to fill the gap inside them. Which leads to a worldwide battle between ego’s. A world of competition for so called “individuality”.
It is simply a syndrome from the way of living that we have allowed in this current system.

People talk about democracy but where is it? It is not even being lived, people are not given an equal starting point and are manipulated because of the profit driven machine to have different believes and opinions, shaping their views and even their choices, and yes, even their votes.

Many of us do not like the current system, many people dislike it, so the question is: why do we allow it?
Why do you participate?

Because we have become numb and believe this is the only way, that there is no other way. So Equal money is the installation of the power of the people, overcoming the minority that have controlled this system and made sure it is kept in place by the ones they allow to be in place. Do you think this system works by chance, no it is very well planned.

The majority on this planet suffers. Give the majority a real voice, and they will not choose this current system.
We want to give the majority the voice. Not the minority that rules all  currently.

equality and oneness is not communism – because communism still exists within the context of a country and people – separate from the rest of the world – within that equality exists conditionally and in self interest – where only that country’s people are being considered

that is conditional equality and therefore is inequality

a money system set up within the principle of equality and oneness means that what is best for ALL LIFE is take into consideration – where value = all life. Therefore the value of money is equal to life and all have equal money to be able to have an equal opportunity and ability to live, because within this, the fight for survival would disappear – poverty and starvation would disappear, and theft and money related violence and abuse would virtually disappear

however, the actual equal and one money system is only a step — for equality and oneness to truly be lived where all are free and no abuse exists ever again, we must each take responsibility to examine ourselves in self honesty, to be able to see how we have been allowing ourselves to exist whereby we created a world based in inequality and abuse – and, in seeing the consequences that we have allowed, we will have to change, have to stop existing as we have been – which is the point that most in this world never consider – because to actually change means to give up who we have been – which in this case is products of a system based in separation, control and self interest

with the fight for survival out of the way, all would be able to start focusing on self – facing self in all ways. there would be time for actual introspection and investigation into who we really are and why we exist the way we do

instead of being consumed with trying to find a purpose and survive within the system – because look, everyone actually is just waiting for death – making money to be able to live comfortably until death

that is an extremely limited way to exist – and when all have the money needed to live an entire life – we will have the time to begin realizing who and what we actually are, and focusing on self expression and self exploration

3. “I find the scheme objectionable. They say “the goal is to establish equality on a basic physical level – equal housing and electricity, equal food and water, equal health care and equal education. But human individuals don’t have equal needs for these things, so the whole thing is a nonsense.”

It is clear common sense that EVERYONE has an equal requirement to eat, have clean drinking water and accommodation. What this person probably means is that some people require more food, some use more electricity, some like it more “natural” , some use more water etc… So within the Equal money system we have to make sure that what we “take” from the Earth does not damage the whole. So that there is no unescessary harm done. It is no problem when some require more food than others, but what will not be allowed is the promotion of food that damages the body, as what is currently being done in this system to make profit. We have to become grateful again for the food that is here for us to live. We take it all for granted.
Also in the Equal Money system, no profit drive is present, and no poverty is allowed. So no worker can be forced to do a shitty job like in todays system, when the sweatshop workers have to work sometimes 16 hours a day and barely survive. Many of them attempt suicide. And they have to take those jobs, because they have no alternative and there are thousands of others ready to take their place. Big brand like Nike do this, simply to be able to make profit.

4. “being that there is the opportunity to earn extra money for things that aren’t necessarily needed in order to live, wouldn’t this open up potential for crime and greed again?”

‘Crime’ and ‘Greed’ are conditions that come in as the result of one’s environment. If we change the environment, the ‘condition’ will change. Meaning – in our current society ‘crime’ and ‘greed’ are encouraged through our Capitalistic System (E.g. creating abundance in one spot whilst creating scarcity in another, promoting competition and a ‘must win’, ‘must have more’ mindset, etc).
If you observe animals for instance that come from “abusive” past or a situation where food was not always available, once food becomes available the will ‘stuff’ themselves (greed) – but only because of the condition they came from.

So initially we might encounter some points of ‘greed’ as people become accustomed to the new environment/condition, but otherwise I don’t see why such points would come into being.

Also the EMS will in no way allow greed and crime. Right now, greed is accepted by the system and even used by those in power.
Profit as it is today, is created through the ability to manipulate people for one’s own advantage. In an equal money system, there will be no people that need to take those jobs to survive. Because their survival is already guaranteed from birth. So no one can manipulate them to MAKE them work for them. Today we have situations where people have to work 18 hours a day, in strenuous conditions resulting in physical and mental harm, all because they have no other choice. They need to take those jobs to be able to pay for food and housing. A lot of them are seen as products which are replaceable by other products. So if they don’t want that job, another will take their place. Such situations will thus not exist anymore. No one can make profit by abusing another.

5. what kind of extra, non-necessities would there be if no one was working to make unnecessary goods? Or could some people work to make luxuries? Wouldn’t this also get people to make personal incomes without helping society, thus creating more potential for greed? Or would the system actually make it illegal to make luxuries? There would have to be luxuries in order for people to want to work extra.

Since there is a Labour-System in place to provide people with extra credits to buy luxuries – the production of luxuries is implied.

After the four years of mandatory, one can look at what other skills one might want to acquire, and see what line of job he/she would enjoy. This does not mean that ‘they are not helping society’ – it just means that they will no-longer be functioning in a position where they provide society with the basics (unless of course they enjoyed what they were doing and would like to continue with this). They can now go for instance in car or computer industry – which is something society will still benefit from even though it is not a ‘basic necessity’. Greed will be hard to indulge in, as there is no way one will be able to ‘make more money’ – unless you work more (Give and you will Receive –Principle). There will be no ‘shortcuts’, and there will be no competition as only products which are designed to their ultimate degree of effectiveness will be allowed to be sold.

6. And what about the possible lack of work on jobs like sewage control? It would be much more pleasant to work with food or water, so why not do that instead of sewage? It all pays the same. Or would certain unpleasant jobs pay more

Sewage control is included as one of the ‘basic need’ requirement points. Thus this point will be covered within the 4 year mandatory. In the 4 year Mandatory an ‘equilibrium’ will be created where everyone will both to tasks that are considered ‘nice’, and tasks such as ‘sewage control’ which is considered as ‘nasty’.

7.what about people’s rights to live differently if they want to? Would this not be an option?

The ‘freedom to live differently’ margin will still have it perimeters within the actual system, and will thus in a way remain limited. If you want to have what everyone else has, you’re going to have to put the exact same effort into it as everyone else. The principle of the Equal Money System is to put into effect that which is Best for All – as long as ones particular lifestyle does not interfere with this principle – then I do not see a problem with it.

8. What would happen to someone if they did not comply with this system? It seems that this will be a big problem to a lot of people, particularly when the system first starts (Although I’m sure if it happens, it won’t just come out of nowhere. People would probably be used to the idea before it is fully used.).

Once the system is fully integrated, and the newer generation is born into this particular system – the non-compliance should not be much of a problem (as with any other system one gets born into, we accept it as ‘the way it is’). Though I can understand your concern with the transition phase.

A suggestion to facilitate the transition more smoothly could be to implement such a system ‘small-scale’ as a demonstration. So that – you are not just ‘forced into it’. It gets tested out, people can observe from the outside and come to their own conclusions. I think this will be a practical way to go about it – ‘seeing is believing’.

Civil rights will remain – within the context of What is Best for All

9. If everyone is given the same amount of money at birth, are they told what to spend it on? What if they run out? Do they just get more?

we are considering that the money will not be given as a lump sum at birth, but rather an “account” is made for each newborn person entering the world. into this account will be credited on a monthly basis sufficient “life money”. the amount will be based on relevant pricing indexes and will be generous enough to cover costs for food, shelter, education, health care, fair access to utilities such as water, plumbing, electricity, and access to public services.

my take on this would be that nothing excludes you from buying and sharing these necessities with your family/friends/partners, but Life Money is NON TRANSFERABLE. Once spent, it is deleted (or it may convert into a “luxury income” which i explain later). This is to prevent abuse by parents who over indulge by using the Life Money of their children or vice versa.

Life Money can ONLY be used on goods/services necessary for a person to have a dignified life as described above, and cannot be used for luxury or entertainment.

For a person to enjoy luxury or entertainment, a separate stream of income is available which i will call “luxury income”. this income comes from WORK. a person must have a job or profession or perform some service/duty and in recognition of this service an equal amount of luxury income will be given to each person per hour of work. doctors will be paid the same “luxury income” as a janitor/sanitation worker. though the doctor may have required more schooling than the janitor, the doctor went to school at no personal cost to him, and the facilities and instructors who provided his education were made possible by the labor of others- from builders, to engineers, contractors, manufacturers, zoning experts, agricultural workers who provided food and agricultural products used in the manufacturing processes, janitors who cleaned and maintained the facilities, countless staff members who contributed their personal time, and all others who contributed toward that doctor being able to get that education- thus all are honored and given an equal amount of luxury income for the time they contributed.

luxury income can be spent on luxury items and entertainment such as plasma tvs, new “better” technologies and gizmos, high speed internet access, movies, shows, concerts, tickets for recreational events, rare copies of old english poetry, laminated posters of joe kou, dildoes, a bigger and swankier house to live in and share with partners/friends/animals/enemies, basically anything which is NOT necessary for dignified living as a human but is of recreational, self expressive, or experiential value.

when a person dies, their account is deleted along with any outstanding credits to their account. no inheritance is to be left for family or friends. no taxes can be levied. no interest can be charged. no debts can be carried.

a person is thus unconditionally supported in this system to have a dignified life and access to the tools required for self movement and self investigation, self exploration, self expression which can be easily funded by an equal labor system based on the actual demand of society and not based on consumerism for profit- since nobody is able to profit “more” than another there is no incentive to make people want to buy useless products which waste resources that can be applied to more practical and useful things.

one thing to consider here is that consumerism and the idea that our possessions make us better will likely be drastically cut back. my perspective would be that much of our current need to attain and have the “best goodies” is about the importance that is currently placed on “self image” within the world.

when we are constantly required to compete with each other while more and more wealth is concentrated at the very top, we have a situation where those at the top spend more and more on luxury, which people then want and desire to have, which causes more people to focus on getting the newest, best things, which marketers and corporations exploit in order to generate the importance of “image” and “status” through possessions, which leads to greater focus on self image and possessions because these things are now equated to “status”, and “status” is important when we have to compete with each other.

if we are able to have an equal money/labor system, there would be far less of a gap between wealth and poverty, and much less comparison would occur between those who can flaunt luxury and those who cannot, which reduces the focus on self image through material possessions, which reduces the industry built around consumerism and self image, which reduces the marketing and advertising geared toward selling the idea of self image to the public, which means having a swankier and bigger house and cool gadgets is not as “cool” anymore.

10. Why using Money as a solution – will money not lead to corruption again?

Money in itself is not evil, it is not greedy or violent. Money is simply an object which we use to exchange goods and services. It is the way money is USED that is causing abuse. In the current system it is the way money is used and defined, that is creating greed. This is generally accepted and agreed upon, because all people accept it up to today. A lot of people do not even know about the real workings of our world. Schools do not explain this in common sense. Because if people would know, they would start to wake up.
The rules of what money is based on can be changed, since it are simply man made rules, and no man made rule is unchangeable. It is an AGREED rule, and rules can be changed when they are proven and shown to not be effective.

An example of such a rule, is that: no one has right to any money unless someone has worked for it. This rule dictates that children will receive no support in this world unless directly by Parents that work to earn money to sustain the child or indirectly through redirected taxes. (A third way can be through charity but that is not consistent enough to be of any significance in the bigger picture.)
A consequence of this rule is that children born on earth in the current system have no right to exist – because the fact that this child exists does not grant it the right to actually have the means to live, which is money. Rights only come with labour – And if you are unable to buy yourself the right to exist through labour, someone else must be found that can buy that right for you.
If you grow up into an area of poverty where there is no social security or help from a system, your children will starve, and you will starve.

This rule creates a situation of fear. Because under such conditions no-one’s existence is ever secure – as your ability to live is permanently dependent on your ability to get money from the system.

Here we can easily see that it is the rules of the money-system that are creating a struggle for survival.

It is important to see that such a struggle is a result of the rules of society – which are man-made – and not a condition of life per say.

Many use the argument that ‘the struggle for life’ can be found in the Animal Kingdom aswell – which is then brought forth as the reason why such a struggle is inevitable in general. Though when placed in the proper perspective, this is invalid: because there is at this stage no reason for starvation to exist or for anyone to exist in any form of deprivation. There is actually enough for everyone today – this fact is well known, and the reason why no change has thus far come forth, is due to lack of political will and self interest behind this.
It does not mean that because we are “thrown in” a system that has used the struggle for life all along, that this is the way we have to continue. We have brains to think, and the means to work on a world which does what is best for all. There is no valid reason to justify people being abused, and the maintenance of a system that does not do what is best for all.

One has to understand greed. Greed is created out of fear there will at some point not be enough. So therefore one will grab as much as possible, disregarding anyone and everyone else – because in fear one is only able to act in self-interest, especially when it comes to fear of death.

Though when a provision exists whereupon everyone can trust, that no matter what, I will have access to anything I require to sustain myself in this world and lead a life in dignity, fear is immediately out of the picture, and so is greed.

Therefore one can see that such forms of greed will disappear as trust gets established and people realize there is no more need for such behavior. It will also have a drastical impact on the way our system works. A system not driven by greed and profit will bring forth better human beings, which will not be raised in a system that raises them to BECOME greedy and fearful, and everything that is needed to keep that very system alive.

So, money can actually be used as a key to change the human experience on earth, where one can walk the streets without fear of being robbed and where one can actually start trusting each other.

11.But if everyone has equal money, who will do the work that is required to sustain society ?

Here I suggest we be very specific. Currently we have a system that consists out of uncountable jobs and tasks that need to be performed. This number of jobs and tasks is based on the starting point of the current money-system. Which is that everyone has to do a task of some sort to gain access to money, without which one cannot exist in this world. Thus if we go and look what is the nature of many of those tasks and jobs, we will see that they don’t necessarily exist to support human beings physical existence and the quality of life on earth. Instead, we will see that for instance a corporation is formed to sell a certain product that – if one is self-honest – it can easily be seen there exists no need for the product they are selling. They create the product merely to make profit, and often create it in a way so that it has to be replaced in a short period of time, so they can make even more profit. Though the existence of such products and services is justified through the need for employment – where it becomes quite irrelevant if the product or service provided has actually any relevance to the quality of life on earth, as long as there is a market for such products and services that allow the corporation to make money and be a source of income for its employees, without which they would be unable to survive in this reality.
The entirety of the system is tuned in with this, and thus people will be programmed to desire and want those products. Look at all the various celebrations where people feel obliged to buy gifts, or where the commercials spawn on tv over and over again to create desire. Where magazines are full of adds to make you think you have to have that product so you can become what you desire, based on what others have told you that you should be/have/desire.

Take a callcenter job for instance: many companies employ callcenters to increase their sales. But if we now look at those companies: they are merely trying to sell a product because they need to survive as a company to generate income. Many companies are actually quite deliberate in this, where they will emphasize the need and the importance of their product, knowing full well what they’re saying is not true. So the employees of such a company together with the employees of the callcenter are performing a task that is not actually contributing in any way to the quality of life on earth – or at least where the quality of life on earth is not seen as having any priority. They are made to attract people to buy objects or services that they don’t actually need, but which will give profit to the one that is selling it.

In an equal money-system such jobs will no longer be necessary to be done. Because the only reason why they exist is to generate income. We’re not even talking about those jobs, tasks and professions in the current system that are harming and destroying life on earth. Of those jobs and tasks that currently generate an income that allow people to survive in this reality, there are many. (e.g. cutting rainforests, hunting for animal fur or ivory, weapons development and trade – one merely need to consider America’s military spending to understand the vastness of this arena – ; soldiers to be trained for war and killing – would anyone join the army if they had no need for the income? – ; alcohol trade, etc.)

Now, let’s look at the kind of arena’s, tasks, jobs and professions where it can easily be seen that they are critical to the quality of life on earth.

The manufacturing of clothing

The building and maintaining of housing & living infrastructure

Energy production, such as electricity

Providing clean drinking water

Sewage system building and maintenance

Agriculture/Food production and distribution

Education and schooling

Healthcare

Organization/Administration

Computer and software

Research

Etc…

So what many argue is: who will do those necessary tasks? why would anyone be motivated to do anything? Let’s look at it this way: do people require to be payed to have the motivation to wash themselves? No, because most understand it is necessary to be done as a matter of hygiene and also because they enjoy doing it! So here we have an example of an action that is based on understanding and that is not done out of profit, because it’s part of ‘taking care of oneself’. Though, to wash yourself, you would actually require water that comes out of your tap. And because you live in a community and you understand that everyone would benefit from having water, you understand that it would be far more effective to have one coordinated system of providing water for everyone, instead of each individually having to sort out their water-issues by themselves. So within the community you come to an agreement as to who will take responsibility for making sure there is water. This is basic common sense. It has nothing to so with profit-calculations, but with looking after oneself in the understanding that ‘what is best for all, is best for me’. The same procedure can be applied to any requirement that would then form a public service.

With the current technology that is available – it would not even be necessary that everyone does a job. Because the jobs that exist would not be based on the need for income but on the understanding of what is best for all.

To practically arrange this, would require a ‘Dual-Money-system’ – because the first step is to have the basics of society organized, which would result in a Labor-system. This would then be the physical support for the entire society. To manage the access to the basic goods and services the Equal money system would be introduced: simply, everyone receiving the same amount of money unconditionally – that would allow for a regulation of the distribution of basic goods and services. Meaning, this money one would only be able to spend on what is agreed to be the necessary requirements to live a dignified life, such as: proper housing and electricity, water, food, clothing, education and healthcare. Those that are actively involved in the labor-system would receive an extra income. This income would be the same for every participant according to the time-units they have worked, regardless of the nature of the activity.

Note that with what we’ve established thus far – everyone is already taken care of.

Now the labor-income will be a different type of money, that has no restrictions with regards to what it can be used for. Thus a space is created for anyone wanting to engage in providing certain goods and services, that are not strictly necessary – but that many would regard as desirable in some way. This space will function as a free market within the equal money-system. People performing a job will have access to a greater variety of goods and services according to their preference. Note that, even though there will be a difference in private wealth resulting from this arrangement, actual poverty will not be able to exist, as each one has a dignified minimum, which is according to each one’s equal right to live a decent life.

12. How will the Money-system be managed – who can be trusted?

The best solution that we’re seeing here is to have an administration – not a government – to oversee the working of the system. Yes, we’re expressly suggesting the system should be largely automated, so as to diminish any opportunities for abuse. The administration will be replaced with an entirely new administration yearly – based on majority vote from the people, whereby one can ‘be in office’ only once and then never again.

Specific training programs will be set up to learn people the necessary skills to perform such a task – where the test will be if the person develops the skill on the one hand, but more importantly: if the person can be trusted with such a responsibility – to always act in a way that is best for all.

Note that our current leaders don’t require to be tested on their integrity to be able to go for office – the one who is able to best deceive everyone will generally win an election, which is why this world has never changed. In an Equal money-system such forms of abuse will no longer be possible.

If you know that you can be trusted to do what is best for all, then you have the answer to your question.

 

Advertisements

Discussion

No comments yet.

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s

%d bloggers like this: